Ultimate Spider-Man Vol. 17: Clone Saga

Apr 30, Christopher Chase rated it it was amazing. Mar 25, Ren rated it it was amazing Recommends it for: Dude, like, what the, wow! Probably the darkest arc line in the Ultimate series thus far, the Clone Sage blew my mind away. I mean, I knew what was going to happen in the long run.

If you've read or even heard about the old one, you know what's going to happen.

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But at the same time, you don't. As they said in the beginning, they knew where they were going this time. Parker's life being turned inside out again is just ridiculously scary. You're literally driven insane by what people are saying an Dude, like, what the, wow! You're literally driven insane by what people are saying and with the emotion that they have while saying it.

In many ways, I think, you're really driven insane along with Peter and MJ. You're right there in their shoes, even though you have a bigger picture of what's going on. In someways, I suppose that's even more confusing.


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And then all of the cameos just rocked. Apr 09, K. McDevitt rated it it was amazing. This review has been hidden because it contains spoilers. To view it, click here. This volume answered the questions I had about a particular character. People seem to come back from the dead, including his father. Clones are made of Peter and experimented on so there are weird variants Scorpian! Peter and not all the clones are completely mentally or physically stable. This is a big problem, as one might guess. The bigger problem is that it's impossible to hide this from the city, S.

Everything gets turned on its head and Peter is left alone in the middle, just trying to hold on to reality. This was beautifully and powerfully written. It's definitely a huge turning point in the series, and it was done really well, though it was very dark and difficult to get through at times because things kept getting worse and worse with no solution in sight. Feb 26, J. So this is a big, loud, confusing mess that manages to exemplify some real comic awesomeness.

It's got clones, people coming back from the dead, and an unlimited supply of surprises. It's not perfect there are definitely some holes in the plot [why exactly does the older clone exist? I'm completely unfamiliar with the original clone saga, but I've read enough mixed reviews to know vaguely that it was a lo So this is a big, loud, confusing mess that manages to exemplify some real comic awesomeness. I'm completely unfamiliar with the original clone saga, but I've read enough mixed reviews to know vaguely that it was a long, drawn-out mess.

This was self-contained although 9 issues or so long , but it didn't explain everything; hopefully, we'll get some further explanations in upcoming storylines. This is the second time I've read it, but this time I'm in context, having read the previous issues or so, and I enjoyed it quite a bit more. Oct 21, carol rated it it was amazing Shelves: What is it that makes me love Spider-man so much? He's a funny guy! This arc, on the other hand, is the opposite of funny. It's actually quite depressing. I loved it, though. I'm one of those people who's either into funny stuff or pretty dark stuff.

Clone Saga is really dark. Each time you think there're no more surprises, guess what? Sure, some things felt a bit too overdone, like the thing with MJ trying not to What is it that makes me love Spider-man so much? Sure, some things felt a bit too overdone, like the thing with MJ trying not to spoil anyone , but from the way it ended, seems like there'll be repercussions, so I'm curious to see how that'll turn out.

Overall it's a great thriller! And I really like how Bagley and Bendis capture the characters' emotions. I just wanna hug Peter real tight. Oh, and I loved Jessica Drew, hopefully this won't be the last we'll see of her. Dec 22, Drian Nash rated it liked it Shelves: This frustrated me, half way through the book I was going to trash it, considering Ive recently reread the entire series I was shocked about how bad the first few issues of this are. But it was unnecessary and looked stupid. My issue with this is the pacing.

It ends well, making it hard for me to trash it so much. But This could have been handled alot better imo. Apr 17, Sean Brennan rated it it was amazing Shelves: Apart from the ultimate universe I have not read any marvel comics post , so writing a review is akin to after only hearing Elvis Presley records too be suddenly asked to review a Frank Zappa Album. This is by far the best story arc so far in the series, the dialogue is crisp, at times both moving and funny.

Peter wondering why he had not had a stroke due to the events unfolding around him was especially well done. Peter always as the puppet of other people's agendas as been a constant thru o Apart from the ultimate universe I have not read any marvel comics post , so writing a review is akin to after only hearing Elvis Presley records too be suddenly asked to review a Frank Zappa Album. Peter always as the puppet of other people's agendas as been a constant thru out the series. Sep 14, Stacey rated it it was amazing. Apparently the original run of Spider-Man had a whole clone thing. I'm not aware of that.

I do know that I enjoyed Clone Saga from the Ultimate Spider-Man , even though it felt like a giant excuse to get Peter and Mary Jane back together after their earlier break up. By far, the most interesting clone was Spider-Woman. I'd like to see more of her. The Scorpion clone, not so much. The thing I really like about Brian Michael Bendis is his ability to give real emotion to his characters.

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The scene wh Apparently the original run of Spider-Man had a whole clone thing. The scene where Peter finally tells Aunt May his secret is really moving. His reaction to her subsequent heart attack just feels real. Jan 06, Edward Cheer rated it really liked it. But, after reading Bendis' take on it, I did enjoy myself. The plot can take some unbelievable turns, but I still love how each character shines and gets their moments.

I especially liked the ending, when I thought Bendis would talk the well-worn "get out of jail free card" superhero ending, with someone finding out their identity, but let it rest, and I respected him for it. I like decisions and actions that have actual impacts. Feb 26, Shaun rated it it was amazing. I'm not really sure if all the prior volumes led up to my enjoyment of Volume 17, but this volume of Ultimate Spiderman was the most fun I've had with a superhero comic in a long time. The pacing was perfect, the stakes for Peter Parker were high and he was forced to change how he normally does things calling other characters in for help and letting go of a few secrets.

This really felt like a turning point in the larger plot of Ultimate Spiderman and it was handled with the perfect combinatio I'm not really sure if all the prior volumes led up to my enjoyment of Volume 17, but this volume of Ultimate Spiderman was the most fun I've had with a superhero comic in a long time. This really felt like a turning point in the larger plot of Ultimate Spiderman and it was handled with the perfect combination of bombastic action and gravitas. Mar 31, jlf rated it it was amazing.

I have no idea why it took so long for these issues to come out in trade paperback, but I almost feel like it was worth the wait-- it had been so long since I read this series that I'd forgotten how fucking great it is. Bendis is, without question, the best dialogue writer in comics. The awesomeness of this arc more than made up for the execrable Ultimate X-men crossover story of the last trade.

The Ultimate X-men piss all over every book they appear in. Aug 06, M rated it really liked it. I loved Ben Reilly. Yet the convoluted mess of the original Clone Saga confined him to nothingness.

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In the Ultimate Universe, Peter faces off against himself in various incarnations. A cybernetically enhanced Scorpion, a multi-armed Tarantula, and scarred Kaine, and even a female Spider-Woman provide intrigue and a breath of fresh air into this Saga - especially when the mastermind is finally revealed! Dec 22, Esosa rated it it was amazing.

Definitely want to read more about Jessica Drew now. I'm so sad that I don't have volume Oct 27, Derek Holmes rated it really liked it. My expectations were low. However I found this Ultimate Universe reimaginging to be a highly enjoyable read, accompanied with some great artwork. Apr 28, B rated it liked it Shelves: This seems like a very good Spider-Man story.

There are three real problems with it: It's more like a "Too Many Spider-Men. There are no discussion topics on this book yet. About Brian Michael Bendis. A comic book writer and erstwhile artist. He has won critical acclaim including five Eisner Awards and is one of the most successful writers working in mainstream comics. Though he started as a writer and artist of independent noir fiction series, he shot A comic book writer and erstwhile artist. Though he started as a writer and artist of independent noir fiction series, he shot to stardom as a writer of Marvel Comics' superhero books, particularly Ultimate Spider-Man.

Bendis first entered the comic world with the "Jinx" line of crime comics in Bendis is writing the film version of Jinx for Universal Pictures with Oscar-winner Charlize Theron attached to star and produce. Bendis is one of the premiere architects of Marvel's "Ultimate" line: He has also previously done work on Daredevil, Alias, and The Pulse. Other books in the series. Ultimate Spider-Man Collected Editions 1 - 10 of 22 books. Books by Brian Michael Bendis. Trivia About Ultimate Spider-M It was claimed that the Gwen clone was really a woman named Joyce Delany who was seemingly cured of the virus and left to lead her own life once more.

More years passed before Spider-Man's clone reappeared. He had survived the battle and for five years had lived an existence under the name Ben Reilly a combination of Peter's Uncle Ben 's first name and Aunt May 's maiden name , and develops a superhero identity of his own as Scarlet Spider after returning to New York City. A series of chaotic events followed, in which Peter and Ben were plagued by both a resurrected Jackal and by Kaine , who was an unsuccessful first clone. In the process, another clone of Spider-Man became the villain Spidercide. Matters were further confused by the interventions of the mysterious and seemingly all-powerful Judas Traveller and Scrier.

The revelations made by the High Evolutionary were revealed to have been inaccurate, driven by a determination to discredit Warren, who had formerly worked with him. Medical tests indicated Peter was actually the clone and Ben the original. Peter temporarily retired as Spider-Man, leaving the mantle of Spider-Man to Ben while he prepared for his new role as a father after the discovery that Mary Jane was pregnant; Peter even lost his powers for a time during his 'retirement', although they eventually came back after a near-death experience. The climax revealed that Peter, Ben, the Jackal and many others had all been manipulated for years by Norman Osborn a.

Osborn said Peter was the original—having faked the evidence that revealed Peter's status as the clone as part of a plan to break Peter's spirit—a claim that was confirmed when Ben died saving Peter's life and his body degenerated like any other clone's. During the mids, Marvel consistently published four monthly Spider-Man series, roughly one every week.

For the most part, the Spider-titles were treated during this storyline as a single weekly series, although occasionally they would separate, pair off, or have special anniversary editions. The Clone Saga ran through all four titles from October to December , in addition to a multitude of spin-offs, one-shots, and ancillary issues. The relevant issues are:. Furthermore, all five titles were temporarily renamed with "Scarlet Spider" in place of "Spider-Man" for two months, in imitation of the X-Men's " Age of Apocalypse " story arc, with Web of Scarlet Spider continuing for an additional two months after the other titles returned.

The original clone story from — was released as a trade paperback in June called Spider-Man: In a re-release was scheduled, now titled Spider-Man: The Original Clone Saga. Though no longer in print, there was a trade paperback released in titled Spider-Man: Originally, The Osborn Journal was to be included. Instead, Spider-Man 75 has 14 bonus pages. The bonus pages are drawn by John Romita Jr. The Complete Clone Saga Epic. As of December five volumes collecting between 12 and 19 issues each have been released.

After the fifth volume the reprint series was retitled Spider-Man: As mentioned above, a re-release of the original s story was released in summer , [ needs update ] bridging the Clone Saga and Ben Reilly Epics. Knightfall ," both of which sold extremely well. Spider-Man editor Mark Bernardo said "Marching orders we were given by upper management to come up with something similar in scope to DC's "Death of Superman" storyline, which at the time was breaking sales records left and right.


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Thus, no outrageous idea was out of bounds. Terry Kavanagh was cajoled into blurting out his clone idea, which first met with groans and indifference, until someone to my recollection, J. DeMatteis suddenly realized the radical possibilities of such a storyline. Howard Mackie revealed "When the story was begun we knew it would be controversial, and that was part of the point. Bernardo added that the length of the arc was initially planned to be short, "The whole arc was supposed to end in Amazing Spider-Man , and leave 'Ben Reilly' as the one and only 'original Peter Parker' and forge a new beginning.

The whole storyline, was supposed to simplify Spider-Man's mythos and ultimately bring him "back to basics. Although the readers had been getting clues about a mysterious figure with links to Peter Parker in the issues leading up to the story, the starting point for the second Clone Saga was the end of Spectacular Spider-Man Sept , written by Tom DeFalco and Todd Dezago , in which Spider-Man was confronted by an exact look-alike of himself. The writers set up the possibility that the clone could be the real Spider-Man.

Additionally, he became known as the super-hero the Scarlet Spider , complete with a unique costume. According to established Spider-Man assistant editor Glenn Greenberg "No one—not the writers, not the editors—seemed to know who or what the hell Judas Traveller was. He was seemingly this immensely powerful, quasi-mystical being with amazing abilities, but what was the real deal with him?


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  • But to be honest, a character like Traveller didn't really fit into Spider-Man's world. Tom DeFalco came up with the idea of making Spider-Man's wife Mary Jane pregnant, feeling it would be a dramatic event that would help set up the saga's ultimate resolution. Bob Budiansky became editor-in-chief on the Spider-Man line.

    The Amazing Spider-Man: The Original Clone Saga

    By then, the writers had established a new villain, Kaine. To prove that he was dangerous, the writers had him killing classic Spider-Man foes, including Doctor Octopus , with his corpse shown to rule out any possibility that he would return. Then, the creative staff brought back the Jackal, the original culprit of the clones. DeMatteis, and part written by Todd DeZago and Howard Mackie, Jackal gave readers doubt and suspicion by stating that Peter was the clone, followed by a reverse statement, and then assessing them as both being clones of an original; because of this, the story was considered convoluted.

    It was this story that kicked off what would become an increasingly tiresome stream of clones, lies upon lies, fake-outs, and convoluted twists and turns. At this point, the creative staff, seemingly without strict direction, inserted a lot of open plot points waiting to be resolved, such as Ben Reilly worrying about "degeneration" of his body due to cloning, why Kaine was protecting Spider-Man but preying on Ben Reilly, why Ben and Spider-Man shared dreams, why Kaine was foreseeing Mary Jane's death, who the mysterious new character Seward Trainer was as well as the identity of the "Third Peter Parker" aka Spidercide.

    With a plethora of writers and editors, the storyline was initiated throughout all the regular Spider-Man series, but slowly grew out of control. The sales department requested extensions to the storyline, buoyed up by very strong sales on the book at a time when most other comics were experiencing a noticeable decline. With this extension, the storyline outlived several key creative staff and many decisions on the eventual direction of the storyline were changed.

    With Amazing Spider-Man , in a controversial decision, the writers ended the life of Spider-Man's aunt May Parker , a major supporting character since Seward Trainer as the clone of Ben. This resulted in a major backlash by fans, that wrote letters to Marvel with various complaints. Goletz said that the next chapter in the saga was to "begin the new era of Spider-Man. Peter and Mary Jane would be written out of the books, and sent off to live in peace with their soon-to-be-born child. Ben would get the chance to establish himself as Spider-Man and move forward.

    Going into the planning stages for what would turn out to be 'Maximum Clonage', the intent was indeed to finish up the clone story line once and for all and quickly get Ben started as Spider-Man. Instead of tying up loose ends, the story was changed in such a way that practically every issue brought up new clones. Instead of being killed, the Gwen Stacy clone was allowed to slip away unnoticed.

    The story arc was heavily criticized for its undefined character motives, and an apparent lack of distinction between villains, heroes, and their allies. Following the end of "Maximum Clonage", the creative staff launched revamps of established villains a new female Doctor Octopus, a new Vulture, and the Grim Hunter, the son of Kraven the Hunter , without much success. DeMatteis resigned out of creative weariness with the saga's repeated extensions, later likening the work to "writing chapter two of a multi-part story month after month".

    We'd get four new number 1's out of it, and it would be a way to capitalize on the Scarlet Spider's popularity one last time before he became the new Spider-Man. What that meant was holding off Ben's debut as Spider-Man even longer. Ultimately, they compromised on two issues of each title. More efforts were taken to solidify Ben as the new Spider-Man, such as establishing a supporting cast for Ben. However, there were many staff that had a hard time accepting Ben as Peter's replacement, such as the new writer of "Sensational", Dan Jurgens. Jurgens wanted to work on the Peter Parker version of the character, and was disappointed to have Ben instead, and so he made a plea to Budiansky to bring back Parker, arguing that Ben confused new readers, and was a disappointment to longtime readers who had grown to love Parker.

    Budiansky was sold on the idea. The Final Adventure limited series was originally intended to end with the birth of Peter Parker and Mary Jane Watson's baby, and finally leave Ben Reilly as the sole focal point of the franchise. The task of actually reestablishing Parker as the true Spider-Man without it seeming like a cop-out was daunting enough that Budiansky invited the whole of Marvel's staff to offer ideas. Greenberg recalled "I think even the janitor and the mail room guys weighed in at one point. It got a little out of hand, to put it mildly At this time, Greenberg recalled, the plan for the Clone Saga was: Forced to wear an environmental suit to maintain his life functions, he would eventually be restored to health by Seward, and at that point, we would reveal his identity.

    The Scrier would be revealed as Mephisto , who would appear at the end of the "time loop" to give Ben the option of saving Peter's life in place of his own.

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    This would eliminate the idea that either Ben or Peter was a clone, instead asserting that Ben was Peter from 5 years in the future, sent back by Mephisto to co-exist with the current Peter. The Jackal would be responsible for convincing Peter that was sent back in time that he was a clone, thus taking on the ID of Ben.

    The major selling point to this plan was that it would restore the memories of Ben who was really Peter all along and thus hopefully satisfy longtime readers. Budiansky and Greenberg fleshed out the storyline with plans for publication in April While the "Time Loop" idea had won the approval of the editorial staff, the writers unanimously refused to adopt it, with the minimal role of Spider-Man himself in the storyline being the most troubling issue.

    The writers proposed alternative solutions, but none of them attained editorial approval the way the "Time Loop" idea had. As a result, the Spider-Man group was unable to proceed with any conclusion to the saga, despite agreement among both writers and editors that it should end as soon as possible. Finally Jurgens, wrote a memo proposing that the saga end with Ben being revealed as a clone and dying in a climactic act of heroism, while Mary Jane has a miscarriage and separates from Peter.

    He concluded the memo with "This proposal has holes. But I believe it serves as a general framework we can all work with to fill in as needed. This is my last shot. After this, I give up. It roughly followed the idea proposed in Jurgens' memo, but added in the revelation that the mastermind behind the saga was Harry Osborn. As a result of a downgrade, Marvel dissolved the five editor-in-chief positions, leaving only one: Harras rejected the idea of Osborn being the villain and ordered the "Clone Saga"'s finale to be postponed six months to avoid competition with the crossover storyline "Onslaught".

    Jurgens left Marvel in frustration at the postponement. Published issues had already dropped clues at Harry Osborn being the villain, and with him eliminated, Budiansky felt compelled to write a memo forbidding that Harry's father Norman take the role: Let him rest in peace.

    Harras replaced Budiansky with Ralph Macchio as editor, who declared that Norman Osborn would be the master planner of the cloning. Glenn Greenberg recalled that "The reaction was not enthusiastic. I don't think ANYONE - from the writers to the editors to the assistant editors - agreed with Harras's idea, although his rationale certainly made sense to a certain extent.

    Harras felt that there was only one person who could have had the money, the resources, the connections, the knowledge, and the motivation to orchestrate the Clone Saga and disrupt Peter Parker's life to such a profound extent. In order to give Norman Osborn's return some credibility and link to continuity, Greenberg charted a detailed timeline to explain how Norman had survived his death and what he had been doing in the years he was believed to be dead.

    Though this timeline was originally intended only as an internal reference for the creative staff, it became the basis for the follow-up one-shot, "The Osborn Journals". Ex-editor-in-chief Tom DeFalco said that under him, the Clone Saga would have been resolved in a different way: Act One would climax at or around Amazing —when we revealed that Pete was the clone and Ben was the real guy.

    Act Two would last around three months and follow Ben's adventures. Mark and I was hoping the Spider-crew could make Ben a viable character during his turn in the spotlight, and we planned to star Ben in his own monthly title after Peter returned. It was kind of like what I had already done with Thor and Thunderstrike —two very different titles based on a single concept. Of course, our plan went into the trash the day I got fired. Series co-creator Howard Mackie described how this project was born: The original notes showed that the story was planned as a three month event spread across the four monthly Spider-Man titles.

    At some point Ralph talked to Joe Quesada, and I got a phone call from Ralph [Macchio] asking if I wanted to do a mini-series showing a version that was truer to what the writers originally imagined. Tom and I remember certain story points differently. The goal with this mini-series was get back to basics, to strip away the extraneous stuff that got layered onto the original story, and to present the cleanest possible version of what was a pretty simple story at heart.

    It was decided that it would be best if only two writers collaborated on this mini-series. According to DeFalco, the series closely followed Mackie's notes, but necessarily filled out what was essentially a rough outline with details. In addition, they decided that Jackal and Kaine had to be included in the story in order to cater to fan expectations, even though neither character is mentioned in Mackie's notes.

    Ben Reilly and Peter bond after Kaine attacks them, and Ben stays in New York as Peter's blond-haired cousin so he can build a life of his own. He adopts the identity of the Scarlet Spider and works at the Daily Grind. Ben, Peter, and Kaine reach the lair of the shadowy figure responsible for infecting Aunt May and Mary Jane with a genetic virus. The villain is revealed to be the Jackal, who captures all three and reveals that he plans to make an army of Spider-clones and take over the world. Since Ben was the only clone to turn out stable, Jackal takes a sample of his blood to perfect his cloning technique.

    A mastermind over Jackal wants the blood sample as well, for the body of Norman Osborn. During the subsequent fight, the clones dissolve and Jackal suggests that Ben is the original Peter Parker. Peter retires, saying Ben is the real one, so Ben creates a new costume. Peter and MJ begin planning for their baby with the support of Aunt May, while Peter focuses on acquiring a research grant.